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Do diesels have a future?
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Posted 5/21/2006 10:21 PM
firstmb

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Do diesels have a future?

Interesting Article:

________________________________________

Should the "dirty diesels" be scrapped once and for all in favour of cleaner technologies? There are those who think so, especially in the US -- but maybe they just haven't been paying attention. There's no such confusion in Europe, for instance.

Diesel engines power 37% of all new cars sold in Europe (62% in France), with the share predicted to rise to 45% by 2005 -- but fewer than 1% of new American cars have diesel engines.

One reason is the poor quality of diesel fuel sold in the US. A 1998 report on fuel lubricity worldwide found that diesel fuel sold in the US and Canada is some of the poorest quality fuel in the world. Fully 50% of the US fuel was found to be below the standards recommended by equipment manufacturers.
http://www.biodiesel.org/pdf_files/Lubricity.PDF

Big Oil has dragged it's feet in cleaning up diesel fuel in the US. Europe started producing cleaner, low-sulfur diesel fuel in 1990; the US plans to follow in 2006. And the new generation of clean diesels either can't meet the US emissions standards on the dirty US fuel, or they can't even use it. But they run just fine on biodiesel, with very low emissions.

For a possible view of the future, we have to look to the past. The Elsbett engine -- the 3-cylinder SVO (Straight Vegetable Oil) diesel motor designed by the late Ludwig Elsbett, was a highly advanced true multifuel engine, and the forerunner of all DI diesels made today. Details:
http://www.elsbett.com/
gd/eteche.htm
More detail (in German):
http://www.elsbett.com/gd/etech.htm

News article about a Mercedes fitted with the amazing Elsbett engine (120kb graphic file).

Diesel motor development is very advancing rapidly, with tremendous improvements in efficiency, economy, performance and emissions -- but not, as yet, in the direction of true mutlifuel motors that can run on petroleum diesel fuel, biodiesel, SVO, or any combinatioin of the three without modification and under full manufacturer's warranty. This is what the fast-growing international biofuels community is pushing for.

Meanwhile, there are signs of change in increasing use of diesels in the US:

"Panel tells EPA no technical problems getting sulfur out of diesel fuel" -- Washington, Associated Press, October 30, 2002: There are no technical problems that should prevent refiners from producing nearly sulfur-free diesel by 2006 when new requirements for the cleaner fuel go into effect, an advisory panel told the Environmental Protection Agency. The report by an independent review panel, whose members included both oil industry representatives and environmental advocates, concluded "there are no technological impediments" to refineries reducing the amount of sulfur in diesel from the current 500 parts per million to 15 parts per million.
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/science/
20021030-1438-cleandiesel.html

"Clean-Air Czar of California Shifts to Accept Diesel Engines -- In Controversial Turn-Around, Regulator Sees Diesel as Alternative in Global-Warming Fight" -- The Wall Street Journal, October 24, 2002: For years, Alan Lloyd has regarded diesel as a dirty word, synonymous with brown haze and cancer-causing black soot. It's a view he has shared with environmental activists across the U.S. But in a striking change of heart that could alter the kinds of cars and trucks Americans drive, the chairman of the powerful California Air Resources Board is taking a new look at diesel vehicles. He thinks they're poised to emerge as part of the solution to a different environmental problem that's gaining more attention in the U.S.: global warming... Here, diesel engines are the greener option because they don't pump out as much so-called greenhouse gas as gasoline engines do... Dr. Lloyd says he has concluded that a new generation of high-tech diesels developed for Europe bear little resemblance to the smoke-spewers that Americans remember from the 1970s and 1980s.
http://forums.biodieselnow.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=294

See Diesels in the US

"First Test: 2002 Ford Focus Tdci; Diesel-powered Pocket-rocket" -- Motor Trend (August 2002): Ford's 1.8L turbo-powered Focus isn't sold in the United States. That could change. Oil-burning Foci like this one -- borrowed from Ford's Scientific Research Laboratory in Dearborn, Michigan -- have been wowing Europeans for a year. Future California emission laws for particulates and oxides of nitrogen are posing stiff problems for the lab types. They say they have catalysts and other solutions that'll work, but only if the sulfur content in U.S.-spec diesel fuel is substantially reduced.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/wagon/112_0208_focus/index.html

"There is no argument anywhere in the auto industry that more low-sulfur diesel fuels are needed to help bring cleaner, advanced, direct-injection diesel engines to market in the United States." -- "The Debate Over Diesel", by Warren Brown, Washington Post, September 6, 2002


Complete article at: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_future.html
#14882
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Author
Posted 5/21/2006 11:08 PM
BenzDieselTuner

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Re: Do diesels have a future?

well, all the diesel sold in entire Germany is 100 percent sulpfur free...........its says right on the government sticker on the pump........

and now, u can buy "high performance" diesel, which raises power, and reduces emmissions even more...............for the cost of 10 cents more per liter......
#14901 - in reply to #14882
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Posted 5/22/2006 6:13 PM
AsianML

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Re: Do diesels have a future?

A CDI or Bluetec is probably one of my dream cars at this moment. Lower emissions, quieter, ungodly amount of torque compared to it's gasser counterpart, speed.
#15116 - in reply to #14901
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Posted 5/22/2006 8:53 PM
jdc1244

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
RE: Do diesels have a future?

They very much have a future. And Mercedes is investing in the future of diesel. The first two images are the V8 CDI. The last image is the 2.7 L 5 cylinder CDI. There's even an AMG V8 diesel.



(mb v8 cdi.jpg)



(000712_v8engine.jpg)



(g270cdi-engine 5 cyl.jpg)



Attachments
----------------
Attachments mb v8 cdi.jpg (94KB - 1 downloads)
Attachments 000712_v8engine.jpg (19KB - 1 downloads)
Attachments g270cdi-engine 5 cyl.jpg (81KB - 1 downloads)
#15195 - in reply to #14882
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Posted 5/22/2006 10:38 PM
BenzDieselTuner

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Re: Do diesels have a future?

those C Klasse hatchback cars? well, the AMG C32 version, )the only AMG model for that hatchback, is a CDI, and is the FASTEST of them all.....
#15234 - in reply to #15195
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Posted 5/22/2006 11:05 PM
BenzDieselTuner

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Re: Do diesels have a future?

i'd take one........how sweet!!!!!!!!!
#15247 - in reply to #14882
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Posted 5/23/2006 10:54 AM
Gareth Coe

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Re: Do diesels have a future?

BenzDieselTuner - 5/23/2006 4:05 AM i'd take one........how sweet!!!!!!!!!

Well, if they're giving them away...

save one for me too

#15353 - in reply to #15247
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Posted 5/25/2006 5:53 PM
Roch207
Expert




Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Palmetto State
Vehicle(s): 2005 E320 CDI, 2010 Silverado 2500HD
Posts: 3749
2000
RE: Do diesels have a future?

A future? They did not state truck stats. 100% of over the road trucks in the US are powered by Diesel. So I don't think we will see the fuel disappear. Unfortunately, I live in one of the fantastic five states that ban diesel automobiles. No hope for a brand new one until 2009. I can only buy one now if it has 7,500 miles. The dealers in RI are all creating demos for us MA users.

Anxiously awaiting
G320 CDI
ML 320 CDI
#16167 - in reply to #14882
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Posted 5/25/2006 8:40 PM
BenzDieselTuner

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
Re: Do diesels have a future?

hopefully the govercrats there screw their heads on straight soon, so u dont have to wait so long.......
#16234 - in reply to #16167
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Posted 5/25/2006 9:25 PM
jdc1244

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
RE: Do diesels have a future?

It could be argued that diesels are the future.
#16244 - in reply to #14882
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Posted 6/7/2006 6:54 PM
BenzDieselTuner

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
RE: Do diesels have a future?

they say that, in the 123 bible.............that Diesels ARE the future, guaranteed.....

and the advertisements, are from like 30 years ago...........

its true, im telling you........
#20234 - in reply to #14882
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Posted 8/8/2006 8:09 AM
BenzDieselTuner

Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
RE: Do diesels have a future?

firstmb - 5/21/2006 10:21 PM

Interesting Article:

________________________________________

Should the "dirty diesels" be scrapped once and for all in favour of cleaner technologies? There are those who think so, especially in the US -- but maybe they just haven't been paying attention. There's no such confusion in Europe, for instance.

Diesel engines power 37% of all new cars sold in Europe (62% in France), with the share predicted to rise to 45% by 2005 -- but fewer than 1% of new American cars have diesel engines.

One reason is the poor quality of diesel fuel sold in the US. A 1998 report on fuel lubricity worldwide found that diesel fuel sold in the US and Canada is some of the poorest quality fuel in the world. Fully 50% of the US fuel was found to be below the standards recommended by equipment manufacturers.
http://www.biodiesel.org/pdf_files/Lubricity.PDF

Big Oil has dragged it's feet in cleaning up diesel fuel in the US. Europe started producing cleaner, low-sulfur diesel fuel in 1990; the US plans to follow in 2006. And the new generation of clean diesels either can't meet the US emissions standards on the dirty US fuel, or they can't even use it. But they run just fine on biodiesel, with very low emissions.

For a possible view of the future, we have to look to the past. The Elsbett engine -- the 3-cylinder SVO (Straight Vegetable Oil) diesel motor designed by the late Ludwig Elsbett, was a highly advanced true multifuel engine, and the forerunner of all DI diesels made today. Details:
http://www.elsbett.com/
gd/eteche.htm
More detail (in German):
http://www.elsbett.com/gd/etech.htm

News article about a Mercedes fitted with the amazing Elsbett engine (120kb graphic file).

Diesel motor development is very advancing rapidly, with tremendous improvements in efficiency, economy, performance and emissions -- but not, as yet, in the direction of true mutlifuel motors that can run on petroleum diesel fuel, biodiesel, SVO, or any combinatioin of the three without modification and under full manufacturer's warranty. This is what the fast-growing international biofuels community is pushing for.

Meanwhile, there are signs of change in increasing use of diesels in the US:

"Panel tells EPA no technical problems getting sulfur out of diesel fuel" -- Washington, Associated Press, October 30, 2002: There are no technical problems that should prevent refiners from producing nearly sulfur-free diesel by 2006 when new requirements for the cleaner fuel go into effect, an advisory panel told the Environmental Protection Agency. The report by an independent review panel, whose members included both oil industry representatives and environmental advocates, concluded "there are no technological impediments" to refineries reducing the amount of sulfur in diesel from the current 500 parts per million to 15 parts per million.
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/science/
20021030-1438-cleandiesel.html

"Clean-Air Czar of California Shifts to Accept Diesel Engines -- In Controversial Turn-Around, Regulator Sees Diesel as Alternative in Global-Warming Fight" -- The Wall Street Journal, October 24, 2002: For years, Alan Lloyd has regarded diesel as a dirty word, synonymous with brown haze and cancer-causing black soot. It's a view he has shared with environmental activists across the U.S. But in a striking change of heart that could alter the kinds of cars and trucks Americans drive, the chairman of the powerful California Air Resources Board is taking a new look at diesel vehicles. He thinks they're poised to emerge as part of the solution to a different environmental problem that's gaining more attention in the U.S.: global warming... Here, diesel engines are the greener option because they don't pump out as much so-called greenhouse gas as gasoline engines do... Dr. Lloyd says he has concluded that a new generation of high-tech diesels developed for Europe bear little resemblance to the smoke-spewers that Americans remember from the 1970s and 1980s.
http://forums.biodieselnow.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=294

See Diesels in the US

"First Test: 2002 Ford Focus Tdci; Diesel-powered Pocket-rocket" -- Motor Trend (August 2002): Ford's 1.8L turbo-powered Focus isn't sold in the United States. That could change. Oil-burning Foci like this one -- borrowed from Ford's Scientific Research Laboratory in Dearborn, Michigan -- have been wowing Europeans for a year. Future California emission laws for particulates and oxides of nitrogen are posing stiff problems for the lab types. They say they have catalysts and other solutions that'll work, but only if the sulfur content in U.S.-spec diesel fuel is substantially reduced.
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/wagon/112_0208_focus/index.html

"There is no argument anywhere in the auto industry that more low-sulfur diesel fuels are needed to help bring cleaner, advanced, direct-injection diesel engines to market in the United States." -- "The Debate Over Diesel", by Warren Brown, Washington Post, September 6, 2002


Complete article at: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_future.html


i find the Elsbett site to be very informative, and interesting...........
#36371 - in reply to #14882
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