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DUTCH
Administrator Doppelgänger
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, GA, Atlanta
Vehicle(s): 2015 Audi Q7 3.0 TDI,2018 Sprinter
Posts: 9963
| Rear Light Improvements
On a lot of the MB models - the G included, the brake, turn and backup lights are all P21W bulbs which have outputs of 415 lumens each. The backup lights (2 on mine) on my G have always been "puny" at best. There are other bulbs which will fit in the same tail light assembly and sockets and have higher lumen outpts.
The P3497 (Krypton) has an output of 566 lumens and the 796 (Halogen) has 780 lumens. The box just arrived, and I'm going to use the P3497's to replace the turn and brake lights and the 796's to replace the backup lights. I expect big improvements in all three functions without having to do any more than changing the bulbs. All are available from
sales@candlepower.ca.
I'll report back as I get more experience with them. |
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Scheinwerfermann
Date registered: Oct 2006
Location: Budapest
Vehicle(s): Too many to list
| RE: Rear Light Improvements
Dutch, my database has a couple gaps in it: When was the rear turn signal changed from amber lens w/clear bulb (such as yours has) to clear lens w/amber bulb?
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DUTCH
Administrator Doppelgänger
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, GA, Atlanta
Vehicle(s): 2015 Audi Q7 3.0 TDI,2018 Sprinter
Posts: 9963
| RE: Rear Light Improvements
Scheinwerfermann - 11/17/2006 4:20 PM
Dutch, my database has a couple gaps in it: When was the rear turn signal changed from amber lens w/clear bulb (such as yours has) to clear lens w/amber bulb?
It happened at the same time that the same change happened with the front turn signals; and I think it was in 2001 (2002 for MBUSA purposes). |
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GwagenLover
Extreme Veteran
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Winston Salem, NC USA 27104
Vehicle(s): 2016 G550 & 2016 GLE350
Posts: 473
| RE: Rear Light Improvements
Dutch,
I found that my 2002 Gwagen tail light lens had melted around the bulbs. The dealer replaced the entire light assembly on both sides. I am not sure if the new parts were melt proof or the same as the old ones. (I have not looked to see if the assembly is melted) This brings up the question: Will the lense cover stand up to the new higher output lamps? I am curious to what you will find in the furture when you change the lamps. |
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DUTCH
Administrator Doppelgänger
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, GA, Atlanta
Vehicle(s): 2015 Audi Q7 3.0 TDI,2018 Sprinter
Posts: 9963
| RE: Rear Light Improvements
GwagenLover - 11/19/2006 11:57 AM
Dutch,
I found that my 2002 Gwagen tail light lens had melted around the bulbs. The dealer replaced the entire light assembly on both sides. I am not sure if the new parts were melt proof or the same as the old ones. (I have not looked to see if the assembly is melted) This brings up the question: Will the lense cover stand up to the new higher output lamps? I am curious to what you will find in the furture when you change the lamps.
I got assurances from the supplier that there would be no problems with heat and melting. That being said, the real proof is in the pudding. The new bulbs are in, but they have not been put to use yet. Stay tuned. |
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MarcO
Elite Veteran
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Irvington, NY
Vehicle(s): G 500 SWB, Volvo XC90 V8
Posts: 835
| Re: Rear Light Improvements
02 had a problem with the housing melting around 21 watt bulbs they were replaced as part of a service campaign on bith my 02s. I hope no one is offended by my comment that htis is another good reason to avoid the 02 Gwagen. I hope no one takes this personally and goes off on a rant about my thinking that the 99/00 is the cats whiskers compared to the 02/03 crapola. |
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Scheinwerfermann
Date registered: Oct 2006
Location: Budapest
Vehicle(s): Too many to list
| RE: Rear Light Improvements
Bulb ratings are trickier to compare than it might seem. The descriptive wattages (such as P21W at 21 watts, P21/5w at 21/5 watts, H4 at 60/55 watts, etc.) are the nominal figures called out in European ECE Regulation 37 (PDF) at 12.0 volts. Also given in R37 are maximum actual operating wattages at 13.5 volts for type-approval purposes. Beyond those limits, there is an allowance of around 15% (varies by bulb type).
North American and (pre-ECE) Japanese bulb types' nominal wattages are at 12.8v. The P3497 that replaces P21W has a nominal rating of 26.9w (rounded to "27w" for the bulb base stamping) at 12.8v. Filament bulb wattage varies exponentially to the approximate power 1.6 with changing voltage. So, let's run our P3496 through that equation to get approximate ECE nominal and actual wattage numbers: w = 26.9 (12÷12.8)1.6
w = 26.9 (0.9375)1.6
w = 26.9 (0.9019) w = 24.3 nominal @ 12.0v w = 26.9 (13.5÷12.8)1.6
w = 26.9 (1.0547)1.6
w = 26.9 (1.0890) w = 29.3 max actual @ 13.5v
So, the actual operating wattage of a P3497 is no greater than about 2.8w more than that of a P21W. For comparison: The '02+ parking lamps are 4.4w @ 13.5v, and the sidemarkers are 5.5w @ 13.5v. This is an utterly trivial increase in wattage, not enough to make the difference between melting and not-melting. The pre-campaign early-production '02 housings that'll melt with original bulbs will likewise melt with the new bulbs, and the later-production '02 housings that don't melt with original bulbs won't melt with the new ones.
The situation is different with the Type 796 bulbs I advocate for the reversing lamps, which are of slightly higher wattage than the P21W originals. 35w @ 12.8v approximates 38.1w @ 13.5v, which is about 11.5w more than the originals draw. What provides the safety margin here is the extremely low duty cycle of reversing lamps. They're virtually never used for more than a couple of minutes at a time, while brake lamps can be illuminated for long periods when negotiating rough terrain (or traffic jams), and turn signals have a 50% duty cycle.
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mb230s
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: SWFL
Vehicle(s): G-less for now, vintage MBs, FJ40
| Re: Rear Light Improvements
Dutch,
I'm pretty sure these are the same bulbs Daniel sold me 3+ years ago. My housings and lenses are fine.
Dave |
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KERR
Date registered: Dec 1899
Location:
Vehicle(s):
| Re: Rear Light Improvements
did you ever get these installed? |
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DUTCH
Administrator Doppelgänger
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: US, GA, Atlanta
Vehicle(s): 2015 Audi Q7 3.0 TDI,2018 Sprinter
Posts: 9963
| Re: Rear Light Improvements
KERR - 11/22/2006 10:21 AM
did you ever get these installed?
Yes, but haven't driven it at night yet. It may be a while, as the G is strictly my "play toy" and I don't usually take it out at night. See Danny's and mb230s's comments for experience with the same bulbs. |
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MarcO
Elite Veteran
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Irvington, NY
Vehicle(s): G 500 SWB, Volvo XC90 V8
Posts: 835
| Re: Rear Light Improvements
Kerr,
Check your rear light housings now before you play with bulbs. If they were not replaced by dealer then there may be an issue with even the standard bulbs. |
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