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Floobydust Veteran Date registered: Mar 2014 Location: Massachusetts, USA Vehicle(s): 1995 E320 Cabrio, 2003 G500, 2000 SL500, 1980 TR8 Posts: 284 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 djdinaz - Thank you for posting this! This is a keeper for my library! NHDave - The amp schematic raises an interesting issue in that there appears to be no discrete amplifier turn on circuit. This could be a problem if you are trying to keep the amp (which I would want to do so as to keep the speaker matrixing and greatly simplify the overall install). There are three possibilities for amp turn on - the power is remotely switched (not likely since the power circuit is identified at 30, which is the DIN 72552 nomenclature for a direct battery connected circuit); the amp detects "signal" present on the inputs similar to self activating sub-woofers; or the amp detects "voltage" on the input leads from the head unit and then turns on (see * below). The latter seems to me to be the most likely to me. If I were in your shoes, I would get the appropriate ISO connector adapter and try running the output of your new head unit into the appropriate auxiliary input leads and see if you have audio. * Head units and amplifiers often use a "bridged" out design wherein the plus and minus sides of the speaker are each driven by their own amplifier. The "plus" side is driven by the signal and the "minus" side is drive by a separate amplifier that is phase inverted by 180 degrees. The result is a doubling of the peak-to-peak voltage on the speaker and a quadrupling of the power to the speaker. Single ended (e.g., non-bridged) amplifiers on a single sided power supply (e.g., a car battery) have to use an output capacitor to keep DC out of of the speaker, but bridged amplifiers do not have to because the have 1/2 VCC (in a car about 6 volts) on each speaker lead and so net DC on the speaker is 0. It is this 6 or so volts that the auxiliary amp may be detecting in order to "turn on". | ||
#228739 - in reply to #228735 | |||
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thebigblue Date registered: Jan 2012 Location: Vehicle(s): | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 So would this indicate that the speaker output from the Command could either drive speakers directly AND also alternatively via the amplifier under the driver seat? Same signal? Thanks | ||
#228741 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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NHDave Extreme Veteran Date registered: Dec 2013 Location: Seacoast NH. Vehicle(s): 2004 AMG Posts: 464 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Thank you Flooby, I have the ISO adapter from Metra 70-9401 I'm banking on what you believe to power the amp and Keith500's experience with his install. Fingers crossed | ||
#228743 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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NHDave Extreme Veteran Date registered: Dec 2013 Location: Seacoast NH. Vehicle(s): 2004 AMG Posts: 464 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 KeithG500 - 6/23/2015 3:38 PM NHDave - 6/23/2015 1:25 PM Keith, did you need to install a fiber optic loopback from the command? No, nor do I even know what that is. It's a pretty easy installation. You need ACC Power from the Cig Lighter. The Harness is approx. 99% Plug-N-Play. I recently finished the Backup camera, Tapped the reverse wire from the Rear CD Changer Area. I can email you some pics... Keith Keith Pics would be awesome!!! I now see why we need to tap into the cig for ACC. Did you also tap into the cig for illumination/dimmer? I'm planning to wire the back up camera while the console is apart, so I'll need a tap into the reverse signal wiring as well. Is there no tap closer to the head unit? Here's a diagram of the command I borrowed from Floobydust. Thank you for your help. (Screen Shot 2015-06-25 at 1.57.28 PM.png) Attachments ---------------- Screen Shot 2015-06-25 at 1.57.28 PM.png (149KB - 5 downloads) | ||
#228746 - in reply to #228710 | |||
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NHDave Extreme Veteran Date registered: Dec 2013 Location: Seacoast NH. Vehicle(s): 2004 AMG Posts: 464 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 New head unit worked, with all speakers, as far as I could tell. Yet to program the steering wheel, more to come! | ||
#228750 - in reply to #228743 | |||
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Floobydust Veteran Date registered: Mar 2014 Location: Massachusetts, USA Vehicle(s): 1995 E320 Cabrio, 2003 G500, 2000 SL500, 1980 TR8 Posts: 284 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 NHDave - 6/25/2015 7:53 PM New head unit worked, with all speakers, as far as I could tell. Yet to program the steering wheel, more to come! Excellent! | ||
#228751 - in reply to #228750 | |||
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KeithG500 Member Date registered: Oct 2014 Location: Largo FL Vehicle(s): 2005 G500 Silver Posts: 25 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Dave, My installation was a little easier than yours, I guess our setup is different. With the C-Class Harness I was only missing the ACC power. I read you can Tap a wire under the Steering wheel for reverse signal, but I used the one in the Rear CD Changer Area. I traced the wire from the Reverse Light (gray wire with yellow tracer) to the Large Wire Harness attached to the Wheel well. I ran a 3 conductor wire and RCA Jack from the Radio to the Rear. This way the camera has Power whenever the Car is on (1 to Reverse Signal, 1 to ACC and one to Ground). Steering Wheel Controls: http://contentdocs.installernet.com/documents/vehicle/10962.pdf USB Jack for Arm Rest (my radio has 2 ports, I'm playing music/video from a thumb drive): http://shop.ocp.com/product.sc?productId=306 Edited by KeithG500 6/25/2015 9:36 PM | ||
#228752 - in reply to #228750 | |||
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NHDave Extreme Veteran Date registered: Dec 2013 Location: Seacoast NH. Vehicle(s): 2004 AMG Posts: 464 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 I took ignition/switched circuit from the cig, lighter, as well as the illumination/dimmer, brought proper receiver ends into the original factory connector, robbed from a stray connector found behind the command.. Must have been meant to use with rear headrest audio/video? Who cares? Confirmed, all 10 speakers work. Only three errors on the cluster, two are tele-aid/SOS, other probably CD changer. One note worthy consideration around the antenna connection, find an adapter for Mercedes antenna connection to whatever head unit your planning to install? This set me back a half day.. Thank you all for being here and helping me thru this. Edited by NHDave 6/25/2015 9:46 PM | ||
#228753 - in reply to #228743 | |||
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thebigblue Date registered: Jan 2012 Location: Vehicle(s): | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Sound like great news, I´ll have a go with my unit shortly, should be easy as I have no steering wheel interface to worry about. | ||
#228754 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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thebigblue Date registered: Jan 2012 Location: Vehicle(s): | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 The Pioneer SPH-DA120 will run the MB OEM amplifier via the supplied ISO-plugs, easy install. | ||
#228759 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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NHDave Extreme Veteran Date registered: Dec 2013 Location: Seacoast NH. Vehicle(s): 2004 AMG Posts: 464 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 That part is easy, thebigblue, but the rest of the project,,,,,,,,,Holy crap!!!! Been on it for two days now! Nothing easy about it, with camera and all. Vent time!! Every time I dig deep into my truck, I see the grease monkeys where there first.. #3 phillips head screws chewed up with #2 bits, CD changer had a wire harness under the mounting bracket (flattened like scotch tape!) While looking for the reverse light wire color coding, I noticed it's wire harness was squished between the rear bumper and the mount bracket, again, like scotch tape..... What the hell! A couple questions for you lad's! Do I need to connect the MUTE wire coming off the head unit? I found the reverse wire (gray/yellow) in the CD changer compartment, is there something to connect with up front or is this my only option? Thank you guy's NHD | ||
#228760 - in reply to #228759 | |||
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Floobydust Veteran Date registered: Mar 2014 Location: Massachusetts, USA Vehicle(s): 1995 E320 Cabrio, 2003 G500, 2000 SL500, 1980 TR8 Posts: 284 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 NHDave - 6/26/2015 9:11 PM A couple questions for you lad's! Do I need to connect the MUTE wire coming off the head unit? Since the new head unit combines all functions that were part of the D2B ring, I don't think you will need it for anything. I found the reverse wire (gray/yellow) in the CD changer compartment, is there something to connect with up front or is this my only option? Thank you guy's NHD Is there a wire in pin 15 of the C2 connector on the head unit harness? If so, this should be the reverse signal. | ||
#228763 - in reply to #228760 | |||
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NHDave Extreme Veteran Date registered: Dec 2013 Location: Seacoast NH. Vehicle(s): 2004 AMG Posts: 464 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 No wire used in pin 15, FD. | ||
#228764 - in reply to #228760 | |||
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tradin1 Member Date registered: Aug 2013 Location: Texas Vehicle(s): 2002 G500, 2007 G55 Posts: 27 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 does anyone have any info on doing the same thing in a 2007 g55? i have just added to the stable and want to duplicate this stereo in the new truck. i need help sourcing the dash installation kit, the wiring harness adapter and the wiring diagrams. i have been searching for a while and having no luck with the 2007+ trucks. thx | ||
#229373 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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Mr-Z New user Date registered: Aug 2015 Location: Vehicle(s): Posts: 4 | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Floobydust - 6/24/2015 11:48 AM For what it's worth, here's what I know, most of which is from my work with other models, but should somewhat apply to the G-wagen, albeit in different years. The audio systems in 2002 - 2005 G-Wagens use the D2B fiber optical bus (really a ring) which is an audio only communications link (e.g., no data or video). The later trucks are equipped with a MOST based fiber optic link which is much more capable. Because the D2B bus is audio only, the only devices that link to it are the Command head unit, telephone, CD changer, voice control, teleaid, and in some systems, the amplifier. The Command head unit is the "bus master" for the D2B ring and it also functions as the communications gateway between the audio system and the CAN bus on which the instrument display and steering wheel control information travels. Because of this topology, disconnecting the fiber bus will have no effect on the CAN bus controlled items. However, removing the Command unit will. Most people won't miss the loss of the D2B modules, but one thing in particular that does seem to be an issue is that you will not be able to set the car clock unless you use the SDS system to "remove" the Command in the car firmware as well. As near as I can tell, on trucks equipped with the E66 Sound System option (e.g., Harman Kardon), the amplifier is connected via the D2B bus. In addition audio power output to drive the speakers, the amplifier provides a DSP function as well (e.g., the center, surround, and sub-woofer signals). I think that non E66 trucks are just analog, a la, the Bose Active Bass systems in earlier MB cars. For trucks with the D2B amplifier connection, it will not be possible to use the OEM amp to an aftermarket head unit. Hope this is somewhat helpful. I have a 2006 G500 and the everything looks exactly the same as the 2002-2005 as far as the headunit is concerned. I know 2007 is when they updated the interior a bit so what I'm asking is are you sure my 2006 has a different setup from the 02-05 as far as the D2B system or would my install be pretty much the same procedure? | ||
#229396 - in reply to #228728 | |||
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tradin1 Member Date registered: Aug 2013 Location: Texas Vehicle(s): 2002 G500, 2007 G55 Posts: 27 | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 My my07 does not have dsp settings. It only has bass, treble and fade. I'm hoping I can hook it up like the 02-05 trucks. | ||
#229401 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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NYG500 Member Date registered: Aug 2014 Location: NJ/NY Vehicle(s): 2007 G500 Posts: 43 | Re: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 2007 switched to a MOST network from D2B. However the steering wheel and gauges in early 2007 models could not control the command system as they were still D2B items. Later 2007 and onward got new steering wheel and guage cluster that were MOST compatible. So while an upgrade is possible it's much different than the 2002-2006 cars. However, the MOST network was an automotive standard adopted by a few car companies and most new Mercedes cars still use the network so there should be some knowledge base out there to assist you. Also keep in mind double din dash kits for the 2007 and onward aren't easily found so a custom one has to be made to fit the new head unit. | ||
#229405 - in reply to #229373 | |||
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Floobydust Veteran Date registered: Mar 2014 Location: Massachusetts, USA Vehicle(s): 1995 E320 Cabrio, 2003 G500, 2000 SL500, 1980 TR8 Posts: 284 | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Mr-Z - 9/9/2015 4:14 PM I have a 2006 G500 and the everything looks exactly the same as the 2002-2005 as far as the head unit is concerned. I know 2007 is when they updated the interior a bit so what I'm asking is are you sure my 2006 has a different setup from the 02-05 as far as the D2B system or would my install be pretty much the same procedure? I'm not sure. 2006 was a "transition"year for the G500 - in fact, I believe it was the year that was never supposed to happen ad Mercedes thought they were going to discontinue the G-wagen. In general, if you have a head unit with the little round numerical buttons (0-9,*,#), then you probably have a D2B system and you can probably complete an easy install of an aftermarket head unit. Once the head units switched to square/rectangular buttons, they went with the MOST fiber buss which also forms the link to the amplifier/DSP system. A reasonably easy test is to remove the head unit (leave it connected) and disconnect the fiber optic connector only. If FM radio still plays through the speakers, then you have an analog audio link and and aftermarket install should be easy. If not, the amp link is via the fiber buss and you will have a lot more work on your hands. | ||
#229408 - in reply to #229396 | |||
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Mr-Z New user Date registered: Aug 2015 Location: Vehicle(s): Posts: 4 | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Floobydust - 9/9/2015 8:51 PM Mr-Z - 9/9/2015 4:14 PM I have a 2006 G500 and the everything looks exactly the same as the 2002-2005 as far as the head unit is concerned. I know 2007 is when they updated the interior a bit so what I'm asking is are you sure my 2006 has a different setup from the 02-05 as far as the D2B system or would my install be pretty much the same procedure? I'm not sure. 2006 was a "transition"year for the G500 - in fact, I believe it was the year that was never supposed to happen ad Mercedes thought they were going to discontinue the G-wagen. In general, if you have a head unit with the little round numerical buttons (0-9,*,#), then you probably have a D2B system and you can probably complete an easy install of an aftermarket head unit. Once the head units switched to square/rectangular buttons, they went with the MOST fiber buss which also forms the link to the amplifier/DSP system. A reasonably easy test is to remove the head unit (leave it connected) and disconnect the fiber optic connector only. If FM radio still plays through the speakers, then you have an analog audio link and and aftermarket install should be easy. If not, the amp link is via the fiber buss and you will have a lot more work on your hands. Thanks for the quick response Floobydust!! Will check back in with the results. | ||
#229410 - in reply to #229408 | |||
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tradin1 Member Date registered: Aug 2013 Location: Texas Vehicle(s): 2002 G500, 2007 G55 Posts: 27 | RE: Pioneer AVIC-Z110BT installed in 2002 G500 Wow! You guys are amazing. So my volume buttons do NOT work to adjust the volume and the telephone buttons are blank. Does that mean I probably have the earlier system? I just assumed they were broken and the symbols had worn off the lower buttons! I will pull the radio out and do the suggested test this weekend. On a separate note, as I do not want to derail this wonderful thread, but does anyone think an early 07 could support the newer instrument cluster if the rest of the car is using the most fiber connections? Thx Edited by tradin1 9/9/2015 11:53 PM | ||
#229413 - in reply to #168638 | |||
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