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petesherlock
Veteran
Date registered: May 2006
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Vehicle(s): 290GDT, Pinzgauer 710, 404 Unimog, SIIA Landy
Posts: 106
| 35 inch tyres
I want to put 35" inch tyres on my 460G but am worried about two things namely the castor angle and correcting it and widening/obtaining the correct rims. My G has a tougher time than normal as I race it about 3-5 times a year in amateur events. Any tips or advice on the above would be appreciated. |
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diehardg
Veteran
Date registered: May 2006
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Vehicle(s): 2000G500L, 2015 G350BT, 2016G63(now), 1968 S404
Posts: 220
| RE: 35 inch tyres
petesherlock - 8/9/2006 7:52 PM
I want to put 35" inch tyres on my 460G but am worried about two things namely the castor angle and correcting it and widening/obtaining the correct rims. My G has a tougher time than normal as I race it about 3-5 times a year in amateur events. Any tips or advice on the above would be appreciated.
Why do you worry about caster angle and rim width? How much are you going to lift your G?
I have ORC springs and no correction on caster angle. What kind of race do you participate? High speed rally?
I participate in amature offroad race 10 or more times a year with almost stock setup.
Yasu |
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Arnd
Regular
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Germany
Vehicle(s): 280GE, 300TE
Posts: 85
| RE: 35 inch tyres
How do you define "race"!?
Trophy or Rallye??? In case of Rallye I would suggest you NOT to swap to 35"! Especially you "only" have a 230GE ... I already "feel" the differences in the ration on my 280GE, and I only have swapped from 31" to 32" ...
For a rallye-usage I would suggest you a lift of about 4 cm and max. 33x10,5R15 tires ...
For Trophys think about 8cm Springs or 4cm Springs and 4cm Bodylift and 33x12,5 or 33x12,5 ...
I have 32x11,5R15 on my 280GE and 4.9 Axles and I think it is a very good ratio for Rallye-Driving ...
The acceleration is very good, on my last rallye I could also mess up with some 3.6 Brabus Gs, they only got the better topspeed ... 
GReetings, Arnd! |
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Brent
Expert
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: SW Colorado USA
Vehicle(s): '13 Wolfsburg GTI
Posts: 1754
| RE: 35 inch tyres
I run 35" tires on stock 7" wide alum rims and have not done any caster correction. Certainly you lose some directional stability but it remains very drivable even at 60 mph. I also run more lift than needed to actually fit the 35's, 3-4" over stock. To run the 35's I think re-gearing the diffs is essential. I have 6.17:1 ratios and at 12,000 ft of altitude the truck could use lower gears yet. It works very well under 9000ft though. |
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petesherlock
Veteran
Date registered: May 2006
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Vehicle(s): 290GDT, Pinzgauer 710, 404 Unimog, SIIA Landy
Posts: 106
| RE: 35 inch tyres
I am worried about castor angle in case it has a a detrimental effect on handling. I have already got the ORC springs and currently have had no adverse effect. Is castor angle only affected by a suspension lift? If I increase the tyre diameter and width could this change the handling characteristics.
In terms of the rims I cannot find any rims locally that I can put 35 or 33 inch tyres on. This means I will have to have my rims widened. I am hoping to recieve good advice on doing this from the excellent collective knowledge that exists on this forum. |
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petesherlock
Veteran
Date registered: May 2006
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Vehicle(s): 290GDT, Pinzgauer 710, 404 Unimog, SIIA Landy
Posts: 106
| RE: 35 inch tyres
Hi Arnd, the races are mostly trophy events. Although at the moment I "only" have a 230, I am about to have a 320 motor transplanted into my G  .
I am hoping to enter the Australian Outback Challenge in 2008 (www.outback4x4challenge.com). We are trying to get 8 vehicles over there to compete from South Africa, we pretty much beat the Australians at everything else (rugby, cricket, etc.... ) so we thought we would give them a go at this (please notice tongue in cheek here!!!!!). By giving myself enough lead up time I should have a reliable and well set up vehicle for the event.
Thanks for your advice with the tyre sizes. |
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petesherlock
Veteran
Date registered: May 2006
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Vehicle(s): 290GDT, Pinzgauer 710, 404 Unimog, SIIA Landy
Posts: 106
| RE: 35 inch tyres
Brent - 8/9/2006 6:39 AM
I run 35" tires on stock 7" wide alum rims and have not done any caster correction.
Certainly you lose some directional stability but it remains very drivable even at 60 mph.
I also run more lift than needed to actually fit the 35's, 3-4" over stock. To run the 35's I think re-gearing the diffs is essential. I have 6.17:1 ratios and at 12,000 ft of altitude the truck could use lower gears yet. It works very well under 9000ft though.
Hi Brent,
I have the Suderaad (sp?) 51/2JK rims. I have had advice that they would be too narrow for 35 inch tyres.
Thats good news about it being very driveable
I do not know what my diff ratios are. My VIN # is WDB46023927062431.
Thanks for the helpful information. Pete |
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diehardg
Veteran
Date registered: May 2006
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Vehicle(s): 2000G500L, 2015 G350BT, 2016G63(now), 1968 S404
Posts: 220
| RE: 35 inch tyres
petesherlock - 8/10/2006 4:06 AM
I am worried about castor angle in case it has a a detrimental effect on handling. I have already got the ORC springs and currently have had no adverse effect. Is castor angle only affected by a suspension lift? If I increase the tyre diameter and width could this change the handling characteristics.
In terms of the rims I cannot find any rims locally that I can put 35 or 33 inch tyres on. This means I will have to have my rims widened. I am hoping to recieve good advice on doing this from the excellent collective knowledge that exists on this forum.
Now I know what type of race you are talking about. Outback challenge looks like a fun competition!
Yes, caster angle plays big role on handling but does not change when you just use tall tires. It changes when you lift your suspension.
For the rims, considering the type of offroading you would do, I would recommend beadlock rims or stick to stock narrow rims to avoid loosing bead when driving at low air pressure.
I'm using 7 inch wide rim with 315/75-16 tires. Tire manufacturer suggests much wider rim. I (at my own risk) decided to use narrow rims. I sometime lower to 20 psi but never lost bead.
Yasu |
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petermerle
Expert
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: Cape Town ( deep south )
Vehicle(s): W460 *1, W123 *2, W124
Posts: 1315
| RE: 35 inch tyres
Hi Peter
The EPC lists 34:7 = 4.857. You could look out for a 240GD 48:9 ( 5.333 ) axle or replace crown wheel and pinion . The price is not THAT exhorbatant. You can even get a 37:6 ( 6.166 ) ratio - used in some 250GD's. Speak to Henri about the transplant
BTW if you want EPC send me a private message.
PEter Merle
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Brent
Expert
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: SW Colorado USA
Vehicle(s): '13 Wolfsburg GTI
Posts: 1754
| RE: 35 inch tyres
I guess it depends on what you consider expensive. I am pretty sure the ring and pinion sets for the G axles run from 1100-1300 USD per axle. That doesn't include 500 USD in CV joints that probably should be done and 600 USD worth of bearings and seals to complete the job. By comparison I purchased a R&P set with bearings for an American car this past summer for under $200. |
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4x4abc
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: La Paz, Baja California, Mexico
Vehicle(s): 02 G500
| RE: 35 inch tyres
Brent,
according to http://wwwsg.daimlerchrysler.com/ClassicMain/C2C/etpl?etpl_lang=01
A6023502839 is €641.28
A6013502939is €603.23
a complete bearing set with seals is about €70 (per side) on German ebay
Harald |
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Loki Laufeyjarson
Date registered: Apr 2006
Location: 66°N, 19°W
Vehicle(s):
| RE: 35 inch tyres
petesherlock - 8/9/2006 10:52 AM
I want to put 35" inch tyres on my 460G but am worried about two things namely the castor angle and correcting it and widening/obtaining the correct rims. My G has a tougher time than normal as I race it about 3-5 times a year in amateur events. Any tips or advice on the above would be appreciated.
Castor angle has nothing to do with mounting 35" tires.
Follow manufactureres advice on rim width. Original steel rims can easily be modified to any width. 15" sprinter steel rims can also be used buth then the center must be moved innward in addition to the widening.
Longer(stiffer) coils do nothing to prevent rubbing under full compression and winding that occur under demanding driving. Coils should be chosen in order to give best handling for given use.
Cut off some sheet metal and the only thing that suffers rubbing is the radius arms under full turn. Neither suspension or body lift can change that.
I ride 315/75/16 glued to 9.5" wide widened original steel rims at pressure down to 2-3 psi. (slow in snow)
Main problem is that 35" tires are to small....... |
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